November 7, 2008
Conservatives Lost More Than an Election
By Chuck Baldwin - NewsWithViews.com
That Barack Obama trounced John McCain last Tuesday should have surprised no one. In fact, in this column, weeks ago, I stated emphatically that John McCain could no more beat Barack Obama than Bob Dole could beat Bill Clinton. He didn’t. (Hence a vote for John McCain was a “wasted” vote, was it not?) I also predicted that Obama would win with an electoral landslide. He did. The real story, however, is not how Barack Obama defeated John McCain. The real story is how John McCain defeated America’s conservatives.
For all intents and purposes, conservatism–as a national movement–is completely and thoroughly dead. Barack Obama did not destroy it, however. It was George W. Bush and John McCain who destroyed conservatism in America.
Soon after G.W. Bush was elected, it quickly became obvious he was no conservative. On the contrary, George Bush has forever established himself as a Big-Government, warmongering, internationalist neocon. Making matters worse was the way Bush presented himself as a conservative Christian. In fact, Bush’s portrayal of himself as a conservative Christian paved the way for the betrayal and ultimate destruction of conservatism (something I also predicted years ago). And the greatest tragedy of this deception is the way that Christian conservatives so thoroughly (and stupidly) swallowed the whole Bush/McCain neocon agenda.
For example, Bush and his fellow neocons like to categorize and promote themselves as being “pro-life,” but they have no hesitation or reservation about killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people in reckless and unconstitutional foreign wars. By the same token, how many unborn babies were saved by six years of all three branches of the federal government being under the control of these “pro-life” neocons? Not one! Ask the more than eight million unborn babies who were killed in their mothers’ wombs during the last eight years how “pro-life” George W. Bush and John McCain are.
As a result of this insanely inconsistent and pixilated punditry, millions of Americans now laugh at the very notion of “pro-life” conservatism. Bush and McCain have made a mockery of the very term.
Consider, too, the way Bush and McCain have allowed the international bankers on Wall Street to bilk America’s taxpayers out of trillions of dollars. Yes, I know Obama also supported the Wall Street bailout, but it was the Republican Party that controlled the White House for the last eight years and the entire federal government for six out of the last eight years. In fact, the GOP has won seven out of the previous ten Presidential elections. They have controlled Supreme Court appointments for the past thirty-plus years. They have appointed the majority of Treasury secretaries and Federal Reserve chairmen. They have presided over the greatest trade imbalances, the biggest deficits, the biggest spending increases, and now the worst financial disaster since the Great Depression.
Again, the American people look at these so-called “conservatives” and laugh. No wonder such a sizeable majority of voters yawned when John McCain tried to scare them by accusing Barack Obama of being a “big taxer.” How can one possibly scare people with a charge like that after the GOP has made a total mockery of fiscal conservatism? That’s like trying to scare someone coming out from a swim in the Gulf of Mexico with a squirt gun.
Then there was the pathetic attempt by the National Rifle Association (NRA) to scare gun owners regarding an Obama White House. Remember that John McCain is the same guy that the NRA rightly condemned for proposing his blatantly unconstitutional McCain/Feingold bill. McCain is also the same guy that tried to close down gun shows. He even made a personal campaign appearance for a pro-gun control liberal in the State of Oregon a few short years ago. In fact, the Gun Owners of America (GOA) gave McCain a grade of “F” for his dismal record on Second Amendment issues. Once again, Chicken Little-style paranoia over Barack Obama rang hollow when the alternative was someone as liberal as John McCain.
But the worst calamity of this election was the way conservatives–especially Christian conservatives–surrendered their principles for the sake of political partisanship. The James Dobsons of this country should hang their heads in shame! Not only did they lose an election, they lost their integrity!
In South Carolina, for example, pro-life Christians and conservatives had an opportunity to vote for a principled conservative-constitutionalist for the U.S. Senate. He is pro-life, pro-Second Amendment, and pro-traditional marriage. He believes in securing our borders against illegal immigration. He is against the bailout for the Wall Street banksters. His conservative credentials are unassailable. But the vast majority of Christian conservatives (including those at Bob Jones University) voted for his liberal opponent instead.
The man that the vast majority of Christian conservatives voted for in South Carolina is a Big-Government neocon. He supported the bailout of the Wall Street banksters. He is a rabid supporter of granting amnesty and a pathway to citizenship for illegal aliens. In fact, this man has a conservative rating of only 29% in the current Freedom Index of the New American Magazine.
Why did Christian conservatives support the liberal neocon and not the solid pro-life conservative? Because the conservative ran as a Democrat and the neocon is a Republican. I’m talking about the race between Bob Conley and Lindsey Graham, of course.
Had South Carolina’s pastors, Christians, evangelicals, and pro-life conservatives voted for Bob Conley, he would be the new senator-elect from that state. In fact, Bob was so conservative that the Democratic leadership in South Carolina endorsed the Republican, Lindsey Graham! No matter. A majority of evangelical Christians in South Carolina stupidly rejected Bob Conley and voted for Graham.
Across the country, rather than stand on principle, hundreds of thousands of pastors, Christians, and pro-life conservatives capitulated and groveled before John McCain’s neocon agenda. In doing so, they forfeited any claim to truth, and they abandoned any and all fidelity to constitutional government. They should rip the stories of Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego out of their Bibles. They should never again tell their children, parishioners, and radio audiences the importance of standing for truth and principle. They have made a mockery of Christian virtue. No wonder a majority of the voting electorate laughs at us Christians. No wonder the GOP crashed and burned last Tuesday.
Again, it wasn’t Barack Obama who destroyed conservatism; it was George W. Bush, John McCain, and the millions of evangelical Christians who supported them. And until conservatives find their backbone and their convictions, they deserve to remain a burnt-out, has-been political force. They have no one to blame but themselves.
And since it is unlikely that the Republican Party has enough sense to understand any of this and will, therefore, do little to reestablish genuine conservative principles, it is probably best to just go ahead and bury the scoundrels now and move on to something else. Without a sincere commitment to constitutional government, the GOP has no justifiable reason to ever govern again. Therefore, put a fork in them. They are done. Let a new entity arise from the ashes: one that will stand for something more than just “the lesser of two evils.” As we say in the South, That dog just won’t hunt anymore.
© 2008 Chuck Baldwin - All Rights Reserved
http://www.chuckbaldwinlive.com/
Tags: Barack Obama, Bob Conley, George Bush, John McCain, Neocon
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Thank you, Mr. Baldwin! I needed to hear the truth of the matter. It is sad that so many who call themselves “Christians” have compromised the faith. These particular “Christians” are much like the Pharisees that Jesus accused whose father He called the Devil. (John 8:44). They were colluded with the Roman government for political convenience. They were self righteous, arrogant legalists. They were also the money changers that Jesus angrily ran out of the temple. (Matthew 21:12-13).
Many United States citizens labor under the false premise that this country was supposed to be a democracy. Actually, it was not even supposed to be a democratic republic. It was set up to be a Constitutional Republic, and there is a great difference between a democratic republic and a Constitutional Republic. In a democratic republic, the majority make political laws which can vary with every change in politically correct thinking. In a constitutional republic, there are certain fixed laws to protect everyone’s rights, that must be adhered to.
We need to give up the idea of left versus right, and replace it with honest versus dishonest; then choose are candidates accordingly.
Americans have become blind and the return to office of many of the neocons like Lindsey Graham and Mitch McConnell is evidence of this. My vote was for Chuck Baldwin. The Republican Party will remain dead as long as the neocons are in control of it. At this point I believe Palin is their only hope as the neocons now have her in their cross hairs. I bet they are seething with jealously as much larger crowds turned out to see Palin than McCain.
It does say something when the South Carolina Democratic Party endorses Lindsey Graham instead of a conservative Democrat. It certain appears that there is now one Party in Washington now and all others are not welcome into their exclusive club. The greatest evidence of this was the bail out when Democrats who rail against corporate welfare like Pelosi and Reid were more than happy to sign this Wall Street theft of our Treasury. They really do believe that Americans are stupid. The scary thing is that maybe they are right?
Thank you, Mr. Baldwin for this article, as well as for running for President. I believe that the neocons are to blame for our current political landscape. I listen with interest as Rush Limbaugh said on his first program after the election that “Conservatism did not lose last night. Conservative was not on the ballot. The Republican Party has not sought to be conservative since the new tone was initiated by the Bush administration in 2001,” but that doesn’t stop him from voting Republican. Also I reject his opening statement that conservative was not on the ballot. He lives in Florida, you were on the ballot in Florida (I had to write you in in PA), he choose not to vote conservative. All the usual suspects, Coulter, Hannity, etc., complained about McCain, then said we needed to vote McCain, then said McCain is the reason conservatives lost. No. They are the reason conservatism lost. Thank you.
We need a new conservative movement based on the fiscally conservative, libertarian wing of the Republican party. Who can we offer as a candidate? Buchanan and Paul are too old, and don’t have the slick rhetorical and media management skills of Obama. And we need someone who knows how to manage a campaign with much more integrity than Rove.
More disturbing than the GOP has been (And still is) the conduct of Evangelicals. Following 9-11, Churches accross the nation simply parroted the Neocon message. Not once did a single pastor quote Jesus where he preached “Fear not those who destroy the body and leave the spirit but fear those who destroy the spirit and leave the body.”
Should it even be possible to terrorise a Christian with the threat of pjysical violence? The Bible says “There are non rightious, not a one! All fall short og Gods glory” How then were Churches able to join the chorus of “We did nothing to deserve this!” And start talking about “Those evil Muslims vs us good Christians”? Pat Robertson did post a humble prayer following 9-11 where he confessed the sins of our nationand called the nation to repentance. He was viciously attacked for being unpatriotic and quicly fell in line as just another “Bushbot”.
Dobson allowed Sean Hennedy to appear on his radio program and make the following proclamation: “God has blessed this nation with the most powerful military which has ever existed! And if we do not use it to liberate the world into democracy, God will judge this nation!”
Another preacher on the local radio station was angry with Bush for stopping in Iraq proclaiming that it was the Presidents Christian duty to have our Christian Army purge the entire Middle east of that horrible stench called Islam. The he procliamed that our Christian Army was to go through China and not stop until the Flag of America and Cross of Christ flies over the entire world.
One day in Bible study class, our Church pre empted Bible study and had an Air Force Officer who was just back from Iraq explaing how we were doing Gods work over there. He was intruduced as one who was protecting our freedom by one of the Church elders.
As he began to speak, I wanted to ask some serious questions:
1) Having just retired from 26 years of military service, I knlw what it takes to project power accross the Ocean. How can any enemy project enough force over here to even occupy just one state let alone all 50 and take away our freedom?
2) If we are not in any danger of having men dressed like Lawrence of Arabia patrolling our steets and forcing us all to convert, how then is the enemy able to take away our freedom?
3) Where in the Bible is “The will of the people” AKA Democracy ever spoken of favorably much less actually called for? Everywhere the will of the people prevails in t Bible it is always shown in a negative light. Can you show me just one exception?
4) You boast of the Iraqis who praised you. In my counter terrorist training, we were taught “The one praising you the most by day is the one most likely to be blowing you up by night. How do you know this was not the case here?
Knowing that I would have been run out of the Church, I instead quietly picked up my books and left. I have never returned to the Church since then.
Mr. Baldwin, you are a man among men (except for Pat of course). I thoroughly enjoyed voting for you this year and plan on doing so again should the GOP fail to repent and transform themselves back to authentic conservatism that aligns with both the national interest and the interest of the American citizens (that are already here).
It was interesting to watch nominal Republicans abandon the party, moderate Republicans cross over and vote for Obama, and life long Republicans (people like myself) for the first time ever vote for an independent candidate that held to authentic conservative values.
Thank you for giving me the option and God bless you Sir.
The prime objective of Conservatives should be to fortify Obama’s conservative foreign policy and economic positions, while neutralizing the Radical DNA that is capable of turning the Obama Administration into a Frankenstein freak show.
It should not be lost on the distinguished senator from Illinois that he has won the Presidency at the same time that the people of California overturned court-imposed social chaos, the people of Missouri voted to make English its official language, and the people of Nebraska overturned Affirmative Action.
The Obama Administration will breed Radical DNA at is own peril. The Coalition that won the 2008 Election was Antiwar, Eco-Conservative and Libertarian fortified by African-American identity politics.
Thanks for running Chuck. I voted for McCain but I see your point. My main concern is that many of us are in a Catch-22. If we vote are principles and split into factions we dilute our power and can’t make anything happen. On the other hand, if we vote for McCain (like I did) we stay as one party but it doesn’t stand for our principles anymore. I still think I did the right thing simply because I think McCain would appoint better officials at DOJ, to the Surpreme Court, Federal Bench, and Military than Obama and plus Palin was VP. Nonetheless, I see your point. I definitely don’t think it’s a real easy decision though and definitely think us Conservative are in a catch-22.
I voted for Chuck Baldwin. I’d like to thank Mr. Baldwin for running. I refuse to choose from the “evil of two lessers”.
Mr. Baldwin’s statements are dead on. What if the men at signing of the Declaration of Independence had quibbled over splitting into factions and crawfished about what they believed to be right? What if those men and Concord and Lexington were so easily shaken?
In all this time, has the GOP produced results? What if anything can be presented as evidence that they do believe in smaller government, less governmental interference, and less spending?
Obama’s victory may be the only thing that saves the GOP. I firmly believe that 4 years under McCain may have been the end of the Republican party. Maybe people galvanized by this lopsided victory, can re-tool and reorganize the Republican Party. It seems unlikely. I get the feeling that they will become more like Democrats and the Democrats will become more like Socialist.
When I look at the last two terms under Bush and review McCain’s ideas, I wonder if it’s such a bad thing for the GOP to end. Maybe this is the power vacuum that will bring a 3rd party candidate to the forefront.
I read above that “Why did Christian conservatives support the liberal neocon and not the solid pro-life conservative? Because the conservative ran as a Democrat and the neocon is a Republican.” in the lamentation that Graham was elected and Conley defeated.
What continually surprise me is the urge of “conservatives” to run for the party of Schumer, Boxer and Feinstein.
Conley apparently felt comfortable caucusing with these hard left activists.
His defeat is earned and deserved.
You are so right! The Republican party has imploded by completely losing focus. It is way overdue for the GOP to sit down and look again at what made the Eisenhower and Nixon administrations tick and to learn from their heinous mistakes: never, ever let a Neocon near the party again!
Don’t blame Bush or McCain. Blame the very system that allowed Bush the idiot to win the nomination in the first place. Why did the GOP come up with such idiot? Why did so many people vote for that fool? Let’s not use Bush as a scapegoat.
I would say Buchanan is half right, half wrong. He was right about the dangers of free trade. It made the GOP unpopular among working class social conservatives and Reagan Democrats. Free trade drove away the working class from the GOP. But, hardline social conservatism drove away many educated and enlightened conservatives from the GOP. By ‘educated and enlightened’, I don’t mean the precious boho yuppie jerks who dine at fusion restaurants and frequent the museum of contemporary art. I mean rational and modern people who believe in science and intellectual independence. When the Right took up creationism, intelligent design(IT IS NOT A SCIENCE!!!), evangelical social policies, etc, it lost a lot of support from educated people.
GOP lost the working class through free trade and lost the thinking class through creationism(and zealousness over stem cell research. Someone explain why this research should not be supported when unused stem cells are going to be destroyed anyway? If religious conservatives are consistent, they should even oppose the destruction of unused stem cells as ‘murder’.)
There are lots of things McCain did wrong. For one, he treated Obama as a ‘historical candidate’ when he should have been trying to prick the Obama myth. When McCain ran an tv ad congratulating Obama on the night of Obama’s convention speech, it was STUPID. McCain had 1/3 the money of Obama’s campaign yet spent a lot of money praising Obama?????? Dumb. Did Obama reciprocate in the Swing States in the final month? Did Obama ever run an ad praising McCain’s war hero credentials? Here was a battered and crippled war hero with far less money buying dinner for a crisp, narcissistic, haughty stealth radical with Tons of cash!!!
Anyway, it’s probably true that GOP would today be in a better position had it gone with McCain in 2000. McCain would not have reduced taxes. Reducing taxes was not popular, but Bush did it anyway. In the public perception, Bush did a favor for the rich. This made the GOP vulnerable; so, Republicans tried to woo the people with increasing spending. It was like, ‘okay the rich got theirs, so you get yours too.’. Whether reducing taxes was good for the economy or not is besides the point. The fact is only 10% of Americans in 2001 supported cutting taxes for the rich.
IF McCain had stood by his anti-tax cut position, he would have been much less vulnerable to Obama’s attacks. But, he changed his position during the primaries. A fatal error. When the economy slid, no amount of argument could persuade the American people that even lower taxes for the rich would be good for the economy–especially after the 700 billion bailout for Wall Street.
I believe that if McCain had won in 2000, he would not have cut taxes. And, he would have been far more cautious about spending, and there’s his record to prove it. He had some bad ideas like amnesty, but Republican Congress–with help of some Democrats–would have blocked it. Would McCain have gone into Iraq? Perhaps, but I believe he would have handled the war better than Bush. His idea of the surge was mostly successful. Though Iraq was a disaster in the short-run, it may well succeed in the long run. And, though Iran looks like the winner so far, Iran may be the biggest loser is Iraq succeeds as a generally democratic and modern nation. The freedom bug may spread to Iran. Bush thought it would happen overnight, but sometimes it takes time. In the 1950s, it seemed like Red China would be the wave of the future for all of Asia. But, in time, it’s the systems in Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore, and Hong Kong which swept through China, not the other way around. So, Iraq’s influence may well prevail over Iran in the future.
McCain was far from an ideal candidate, but he is a genuine war hero. Bush… he was a nuttin’. So, why was he chosen in 2000? It’s because of the collusion of the Republican Rich and religious right. The Republican Rich wanted a dummy doll it could control to cut taxes and further free trade. Religious Right wanted some simpleton who mumbled the same prayers and believed that dinos walked the Earth 5000 yrs ago. So, we ended up with a dummy doll president. The rich got their tax cuts and the religious right got their beer drinking buddy.
To win over Middle American that wondered, ‘what’s in it for me’, there was vast new spending with money borrowed from China.
When 9/11 happened, humble dummy doll Bush thought, ‘gee, maybe I really am a great leader’. And, neocons schmoozed him and massaged his ego, and said ‘if you liberate Iraq, you’ll be a combination of Washington, Lincoln, and Churchill’. Bush thought God meant him to do this. He would be one for the history books. Rest is history.
We needed McCain in 2000.
Of course, one could argue that it wasn’t really anyone’s fault but just bad luck. One could argue that the financial tsunami that struck in 2008 was all but inevitable regardless of who was in power. So, had Gore won in 2000, Republicans might have won in 2008. Or, if Kerry had won in 2004, he would have gotten all the blame for the Iraq War and the financial mess, and we’d have a Republican winning in 2008.
It’s unfair but the whoever’s president gets ALL the blame for whatever goes wrong in the nation–even when he had little to do with it.
In this sense, Republicans were just unlucky to have held the presidency from 2000 to 2008.
So, we face a conundrum. We want Obama to fail big, but then the country will have to fail too. We want the country to do well, but then Obama will get the credit and win a second term.
McCain was simply someone who was given his payback for the treachery he helped sponser. Both parties are the same and have been since Reagan left office and the Bush cartel came into power.
911 was Bush and the much warned about nuclear explosion on our soil will be Obummer. Treason does not have a race.
“We need a new conservative movement based on the fiscally conservative, libertarian wing of the Republican party. ”
_____________________________
Libertarian-Republicans ARE THE NEOCONS! Libertarians are open border, free trade, and social liberal like the ACLU. Libertarian-Republicans ARE THE PROBLEM, not the solution. Get a clue.
And crap, didn’t know Linsey Graham won re-election, that sucks.
Oh shut up Lucas, a majority of Americans aren’t rump rangers like yourself.
Umm… Lucas. Once again your understanding of Christianity is completely one dimensional. Did you know that there are entire societies of progressive Catholic and Christians led by post doctoral researchers and educators that in no way adhere to the young earth creationism you have apparently been exposed to as the Biblical account for creation?
You can expand your worldview and understanding a great deal, regarding Christianity at least, by acquainting yourself with competing explanatory Christian based scientific models for reality by starting with Catholic theistic evolution and Christian works by progressive creationists such as Dr. Ross and Dr. Fana (as examples) at reasons.org.
I’m sorry you have been presented in your upbringing with such a one sided comical stereotypical (and mostly false) presentation of what Christianity is. I hope you choose to educate yourself in this arena further.
What is a rump ranger?
I just wanted to invite anybody who holds conservative to moderate political values to check out AmericaC2C.Org. We are a free online group of people from across the U.S., who are working together toward things like Honesty in Journalism, promoting traditional American and Constitutional values, and ensuring a continued conservative/moderate voice in America.
We could use additional like-minded people to work alongside of us. Thank you very much.
http://www.AmericaC2C.Org
I’m told the difference in aggregate vote totals was the Romney voters. Had they come out McCain might not have won. But the gross margin would have been a lot closer.
And yeah. McCain is bad. And to punish him we put a Marxist-Leninist in the White House. I’m not sure that was the smartest move. Tell me again in say 3 1/2 years of economic collapse that it was a smart move.
What do they call that? Cutting off your nose to spite your face.
And Obama? He supports not just abortion on demand but infanticide. McCain was certainly better than that.
Oh well. I predict the Obama years will be much better than the Carter years. And not in a good way. Enjoy it while you can.
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Really - it was the year of the black man. America wanted one and he was the first to show up. Illinois did the same thing with Carol Mosely Braun. A one term Senator.
Some times the voting public is just batsh** crazy. This was one of those years. When the force of reason is gone people do crazy things. I can’t wait to see the hangover. We are still paying for Carter’s snub of the Shah of Iran. Of course the Iranian people are paying a higher price. They are being punished for their political sins. As we will be for the electorate’s choice of Obama. Is this a wonderful country or what? We get the government we deserve. And what did the Republicans who stayed home decide we deserved? A flat out Marxist.
I was under the impression that Marxism was not an acceptable political position for the President. I guess Republicans no longer care about that stuff. Way to go guys. You had a chance to elect bad and chose evil. I’m not sure I see the moral advantage. It no doubt will become clearer in God’s own time.
Well, at least Obama will be sharing the wealth. What will be left of it. My guess? He will get the biggest share. The peasants will get crumbs. That is the way it always works with Marxists.
And when Obama runs out of rich to squeeze? The peasants turn will come. It always does. And what will be the last act? He will start a war as a distraction.
I’m thinking that in about 3 1/2 years from now you will be pining for the good old days of Bush.
Enjoy!
I don’t know why the evangelicals have been acting as if lobotomized. I think one of the Democrats was correct in saying that evangelicals are “undereducated and easily led.” Having Bill Kristol and company camped out on their doorstep feeding them bad advice doesn’t help any.
It seems to me that there are two ways to go: 1) fight to make social conservatism intellectually and socially respectable e.g. in universities; 2) Play tit for tat with the neocons by supporting an economically liberal but socially conservative agenda (i.e. “populism”) Note that all while South Dakota rejected a modestly worded pro-life referendum, while California and Florida passed anti-gay-marriage referenda only because of massive support from blacks and Latinos. The hard fact is that the rich (over $250K annual income) voted for Obama. Simply put, social conservatism loses because it’s largest constituency is among Democrats! Democrats buy the social conservative’s vote by promising to fill his wallet, while Republicans either push social conservatism to the rear or give it only weak or insincere support. So a social conservative rarely has anyone to vote for, Conley or no Conley. A populist part that welcomes blacks and Hispanics with economic policies that are friendly to them may be our only option.
We can no longer pretend that social conservatism fits naturally with free-market zealotry. In the short run, at least, we may be forced to choose between saving Christianity and saving Reaganomics. May God grant us the wisdom to choose wisely.
After reading all the comments, I conclude that there is no hope for a united Republican Party. We are so diverse on issues of the day, that nothing is left of the Big Tent Republican Party.
Take down the splintered stakes and roll up the tattered canvas. The old Elephant died and is no longer able to headline for a circus of variety acts.
The reason why Evangelicals followed the neocon line has everything to do with their belief that Israel is the Israel of the Old Testament. The fact that only 25% of people living in Israel are Sephardic, the rest are Europeans, they have Caucasian features the yare from Poland and Russia, they even have similar rates of cystic fibrosis as Caucasians. Why do Evangelicals insist on this, because of a phrase in the New Testament by Jesus “I will be with you until the end of time”. Over 1500 years of “being with the Christian Churches”, such as the Eastern Orthodox, the Nestorians, the Armenian, Catholic, Syriac, Coptic who can say we were there at the beginning, post Reformation left some of these so called Protestants with a problem what to do with this 1500, what are they based on.. The fact is Evangelical Christianity is a form of bogus Christianity, Johnny Come Lately Stuff, they are a branch of a tree looking for roots. So they buy the Neo Con line because they believe somehow it connects them to Israel and thus Moses and the Prophets. And for the most part they misread the Bible, reading poetic visionary metaphors as though they are some kind of Morse Code, and the rest of the Christian world doesn’t know whether to pity them or laugh at them. Episcopalian, Anglicans do something about it, they give you a bad name too..
Meanwhile at the Christ Bunker, all hell breaks out.
Israeli police have had to restore order at one of Christianity’s holiest sites after a mass brawl broke out between monks in Jerusalem’s Old City.
Fighting erupted between Greek Orthodox and Armenian monks at the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, the traditional site of Christ’s crucifixion.
Two monks from each side were detained as dozens of worshippers traded kicks and punches at the shrine, said police.
Trouble flared as Armenians prepared to mark the annual Feast of the Cross.
Tapestries toppled
Shocked pilgrims looked on as decorations and tapestries were toppled during Sunday’s clash.
Dressed in the vestments of the Greek Orthodox and Armenian denominations, rival monks threw punches and anything they could lay their hands on.
The Greeks blamed the Armenians for not recognising their rights inside the holy site, while the Armenians said the Greeks had violated one of their traditional ceremonies.
Clashes between Christian sects in the ancient church are not uncommon
An Armenian clergyman said the Greek clergy had tried to place one of their monks inside the Edicule, an ancient structure which is said to encase the tomb of Jesus.
“What is happening here is a violation of status quo. The Greeks have tried so many times to put their monk inside the tomb but they don’t have the right to when the Armenians are celebrating the feast,” he said.
The Armenians had been preparing to commemorate the 4th Century discovery of the cross believed to have been used to crucify Jesus.
A Greek clergyman said: “We protested peacefully, we stood here in the middle and we claimed that we shall not leave the procession finished unless they leave our guardian be inside. This didn’t happen and in that moment the police interfered.”
Six Christian sects share control of the ancient church and the BBC’s Wyre Davies in Jerusalem says confrontations between them are not uncommon, but rarely descend into violence.
Just as Bush and McCain brought about the destruction of conservatism (by deceit and ambition), look for Pelosi and Reid to finish off the Democratic Party by their refusal to “examine” and judge the Bush whitehouse.
When you’re on the dole … its hard to slap the hand that feeds you.
American citizens need to work hard between now and 2012 to restore the Republic, beginning with honest elections.
During my prayer time, I have received a number of ‘revelations’ that we (and the world) will be going through a significant ‘chastisement’ for obstinate refusal to honor God and live by His revealed truths.
What man is unable to change due to oppression and corruption; God WILL change through prayer and fasting.
Paleo Conservative, I know there are PROGRESSIVE Christians who don’t believe in Creationism, but again, they are PROGRESSIVE Christians, and as such, liberals, and as such, Democratic voters.
Anyway, they are no better for America than conservative Christians. Conservative Christians are often ignoramous hypocrites who sermonize about Jesus yet stock up on guns whereas generally better educated Progressive Christians are Quasi-Marxists into committing racial, cultural suicide as recommended by Jesus. Does Western Society want to go the way of the Catholic Church, which is being taken over by Africans, Asians, and Latin American Indians?
Now, there is something beautiful and wise about Christianity. One is the concept of Defeat. Christianity reminds us that we are all defeated in the end. Even victors are defeated by life’s problems, old age, illness, sickness, etc. Christianity reminds us that no one or no people are a total or permanent winner. It teaches us the foolishness of arrogance and triumphalism. It teaches us the necessity of humility. Christianity also teaches us about the need for mercy. But, these ideals must be taken in controlled doses. We may all be defeated by old age, illness, or personal tragedies, but we MUST WIN as a people–often through ruthless violence or cold impartiality of the Law. Also, mercy is better shown to our enemies AFTER we kick their ass. US was merciful to Germany and Japan BUT ONLY AFTER TOTALLY CRUSHING THEM. So, Western Society has always been 80% tribal-pagan in actual deeds while only 20% Christian–and only after victory/mastery was assured.
The problem is True Christianity wants us to be losers. And, the more conservatives sermonize about how we must try to be better Chrsitians, the more hypocritical they sound because The Right is really about Our People, Our Nation, Our Wealth, Our Race, Our Culture. If we were to really take the Christian path IN THIS WORLD, liberals are closer to the mark. Not that Jesus would have embraced ‘gay marriage’ or other stupid liberal crap, but he would have been anti-wealth, anti-nationalist, anti-racialist, anti-tribalist, anti-military, anti-gun, anti-law-enforcement, etc, etc. The megalomaniac Hippie Jew said ‘turn the other cheek’. The West didn’t gain its wealt and power by practicing Christianity, only by using it as a moral compass ONLY after winning through paganistic ways. Christian warriors fought the Muslim Warriors in the way that Ancient Romans and Vikings did. There was no Open Borders and Turn the Other Cheek crap.